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<blockquote data-quote="HernanSCL" data-source="post: 3343830" data-attributes="member: 31027"><p>Sin perjuicio de que me inclino por el 767 porque ya lo tenemos aquí (criterio logístico), hay que reconocer como dice [USER=3269]@Crucino[/USER] que a Boeing no le gustó nada esta oferta de conversión de IAI Bedek (presentada en el concurso norteamericano e israelí), por lo que tiene la capacidad de bloquear la oferta. </p><p></p><p><strong>En ese sentido, Boeing tiene su propia oferta de conversión probada, aquí:</strong></p><p></p><p><span style="font-size: 18px"><strong>Italy</strong></span></p><p></p><p>Boeing continued development of the aircraft. Italy selected the KC-767A and signed a contract in 2002 becoming the launch customer, with delivery set for 2005. The <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_Air_Force" target="_blank">Italian Air Force</a> (<em>Aeronautica Militare</em>) ordered four aircraft. This version is based on the 767-200ER and is named the <em>KC-767 Tanker Transport</em>, and is fitted with <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerial_refueling#Flying_boom" target="_blank">boom</a> and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerial_refueling#Probe-and-drogue" target="_blank">hose-drogue</a> refueling systems on the centerline with hose-drogue wingpod systems.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-14" target="_blank">[14]</a></p><p></p><p>Italy's aircraft became the first KC-767 to be assembled. <strong>The aircraft were initially built as 767-200ER commercial airplanes, then flown to a separate facility for conversion into tankers</strong>. Italy's first aircraft made its maiden flight on 21 May 2005.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-boeing4-15" target="_blank">[15]</a> Italy's second aircraft arrived for modification at the facility of Boeing's partner, <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alenia_Aeronautica" target="_blank">Aeronavali</a>, in <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naples" target="_blank">Naples</a>, Italy, on 6 May 2005.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-boeing3-16" target="_blank">[16]</a></p><p></p><p>Delivery of the tankers to the Italian Air Force was delayed due to an issue with flutter of the wing pods and other technical issues. Boeing provided a 767 for training during this time.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-17" target="_blank">[17]</a><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-18" target="_blank">[18]</a> After resolving the issues, Boeing delivered the first KC-767 in January,<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-19" target="_blank">[19]</a> and the second in March 2011.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-Def_News_into_Service-20" target="_blank">[20]</a> These aircraft officially entered service on 17 May 2011 with the 14º Stormo.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-21" target="_blank">[21]</a><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-22" target="_blank">[22]</a> After entering service, the two KC-767s have supported NATO operations in Afghanistan and Libya.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-23" target="_blank">[23]</a><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-24" target="_blank">[24]</a> The final two tankers were delivered in late 2011.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-25" target="_blank">[25]</a></p><p></p><h4>Japan </h4><p></p><p>In 2001, Japan selected the KC-767 over the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airbus_A310_MRTT" target="_blank">Airbus A310 MRTT</a> and signed a contract in 2003.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-26" target="_blank">[26]</a><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-27" target="_blank">[27]</a> The <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Air_Self-Defense_Force" target="_blank">Japan Air Self-Defense Force</a> (JASDF) ordered four aircraft and has designated the tanker <em>KC-767J</em>. In June 2005, Japan's first aircraft arrived at Boeing's <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wichita,_Kansas" target="_blank">Wichita, Kansas</a> modification center to be fitted out with the tanker equipment.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-boeing1-28" target="_blank">[28]</a></p><p></p><p>Delivery of the first KC-767J for the JASDF was delayed approximately two years due to development issues and the addition of the aircraft receiving <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Aviation_Administration" target="_blank">FAA</a> certification. The Japanese version of the tanker is equipped only with the boom refueling system. Boeing and its Japanese representative <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Itochu" target="_blank">Itochu</a> agreed with Japan Ministry of Defense (MoD) to pay a penalty fee for the delivery delay, according to the MoD Statement.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-29" target="_blank">[29]</a><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-30" target="_blank">[30]</a> The first operational KC-767J was delivered to the JASDF on 19 February 2008,<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-31" target="_blank">[31]</a> with the second KC-767J following on 5 March.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-32" target="_blank">[32]</a> The third KC-767 was delivered to the JASDF in March 2009. The three KC-767J aircraft reached initial operational capability (IOC) status with the JASDF in May 2009.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-33" target="_blank">[33]</a> The fourth tanker was delivered in January 2010.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-34" target="_blank">[34]</a> The aircraft are operated out of <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nagoya_Airfield" target="_blank">Komaki Air Base</a> by <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/404th_Tactical_Airlift_Tanker_Squadron" target="_blank">404th Tactical Airlift Tanker Squadron</a>.</p><p></p><p>(Agrego, en el caso japonés el KC-767 lleva solo boom, lo que sería nuestro caso si se da de baja o reemplaza el F-5 por otro vector de origen estadounidense -un ahorro de costo el no tener que intervenir el ala para llevar pods de REVO/canasta-. No obstante lo anterior, están los 3 KC-130R FACh que hoy tienen capacidad para reabastecer por canasta en caso de necesitarlo)</p><p></p><p><img src="https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4e/JASDF_KC-767_%28cropped%29.jpg" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " style="" /></p><p></p><p>Ahora, hay un detalle que me percaté al mirar los casos y es que nuestro 767-300ER es de pasajeros. Para mayor simplicidad habría que buscar un par de cargueros/freigther que ya traen 02 cargo doors para carga y pallets.</p><p></p><p><img src="https://www.airdatanews.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/latam-boeing-767-freighter.jpg" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " style="" /></p><p><img src="https://i.insider.com/63dacde4e33c4000193a95f0?width=1000&format=jpeg&auto=webp" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " style="" /></p><p></p><p>El nuestro trae el portalón para los equipajes donde cabe carga de cierto tamaño, falta el portalón de los pallets en el nivel superior:</p><p><img src="https://www.x.com/multimedia/images/1a666.jpg" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " style="" /></p><p></p><p>Cosa que si traen los KC-135</p><p><img src="https://www.x.com/images/showid/4753840" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " style="" /></p><p></p><p>Otra ventaja del 767 como carguero es su fuselaje ancho que permite mayor capacidad de carga: 58 toneladas vs 37,6 toneladas.</p><p></p><p><a href="https://www.boeing.com/farnborough2014/pdf/BCA/bck-767_5_13_2014.pdf" target="_blank">https://www.boeing.com/farnborough2014/pdf/BCA/bck-767_5_13_2014.pdf</a> (767-300F Freighter)</p><p><a href="https://www.af.mil/About-Us/Fact-Sheets/Display/Article/1529736/kc-135-stratotanker/" target="_blank">https://www.af.mil/About-Us/Fact-Sheets/Display/Article/1529736/kc-135-stratotanker/</a> (KC-135)</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Según lo que se relata en Air Force Montly en la página anterior, menciona que sin perjuicio de su llegada de refit desde EEUU el 982 tiene sus achaques por antiguedad.</p><p></p><p></p><p>El "V" incluye el reemplazo de componentes electrónicos que después ya no serán soportados. El "V" es necesario logísticamente para proyectar la flota hacia 2040.</p><p></p><p>Yo creo que es cosa de tiempo.</p><p></p><p>Saludos</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="HernanSCL, post: 3343830, member: 31027"] Sin perjuicio de que me inclino por el 767 porque ya lo tenemos aquí (criterio logístico), hay que reconocer como dice [USER=3269]@Crucino[/USER] que a Boeing no le gustó nada esta oferta de conversión de IAI Bedek (presentada en el concurso norteamericano e israelí), por lo que tiene la capacidad de bloquear la oferta. [B]En ese sentido, Boeing tiene su propia oferta de conversión probada, aquí:[/B] [SIZE=5][B]Italy[/B][/SIZE] [B][/B] Boeing continued development of the aircraft. Italy selected the KC-767A and signed a contract in 2002 becoming the launch customer, with delivery set for 2005. The [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_Air_Force']Italian Air Force[/URL] ([I]Aeronautica Militare[/I]) ordered four aircraft. This version is based on the 767-200ER and is named the [I]KC-767 Tanker Transport[/I], and is fitted with [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerial_refueling#Flying_boom']boom[/URL] and [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerial_refueling#Probe-and-drogue']hose-drogue[/URL] refueling systems on the centerline with hose-drogue wingpod systems.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-14'][14][/URL] Italy's aircraft became the first KC-767 to be assembled. [B]The aircraft were initially built as 767-200ER commercial airplanes, then flown to a separate facility for conversion into tankers[/B]. Italy's first aircraft made its maiden flight on 21 May 2005.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-boeing4-15'][15][/URL] Italy's second aircraft arrived for modification at the facility of Boeing's partner, [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alenia_Aeronautica']Aeronavali[/URL], in [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naples']Naples[/URL], Italy, on 6 May 2005.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-boeing3-16'][16][/URL] Delivery of the tankers to the Italian Air Force was delayed due to an issue with flutter of the wing pods and other technical issues. Boeing provided a 767 for training during this time.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-17'][17][/URL][URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-18'][18][/URL] After resolving the issues, Boeing delivered the first KC-767 in January,[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-19'][19][/URL] and the second in March 2011.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-Def_News_into_Service-20'][20][/URL] These aircraft officially entered service on 17 May 2011 with the 14º Stormo.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-21'][21][/URL][URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-22'][22][/URL] After entering service, the two KC-767s have supported NATO operations in Afghanistan and Libya.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-23'][23][/URL][URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-24'][24][/URL] The final two tankers were delivered in late 2011.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-25'][25][/URL] [HEADING=3]Japan [/HEADING] In 2001, Japan selected the KC-767 over the [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airbus_A310_MRTT']Airbus A310 MRTT[/URL] and signed a contract in 2003.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-26'][26][/URL][URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-27'][27][/URL] The [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Air_Self-Defense_Force']Japan Air Self-Defense Force[/URL] (JASDF) ordered four aircraft and has designated the tanker [I]KC-767J[/I]. In June 2005, Japan's first aircraft arrived at Boeing's [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wichita,_Kansas']Wichita, Kansas[/URL] modification center to be fitted out with the tanker equipment.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-boeing1-28'][28][/URL] Delivery of the first KC-767J for the JASDF was delayed approximately two years due to development issues and the addition of the aircraft receiving [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Aviation_Administration']FAA[/URL] certification. The Japanese version of the tanker is equipped only with the boom refueling system. Boeing and its Japanese representative [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Itochu']Itochu[/URL] agreed with Japan Ministry of Defense (MoD) to pay a penalty fee for the delivery delay, according to the MoD Statement.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-29'][29][/URL][URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-30'][30][/URL] The first operational KC-767J was delivered to the JASDF on 19 February 2008,[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-31'][31][/URL] with the second KC-767J following on 5 March.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-32'][32][/URL] The third KC-767 was delivered to the JASDF in March 2009. The three KC-767J aircraft reached initial operational capability (IOC) status with the JASDF in May 2009.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-33'][33][/URL] The fourth tanker was delivered in January 2010.[URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_KC-767#cite_note-34'][34][/URL] The aircraft are operated out of [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nagoya_Airfield']Komaki Air Base[/URL] by [URL='https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/404th_Tactical_Airlift_Tanker_Squadron']404th Tactical Airlift Tanker Squadron[/URL]. (Agrego, en el caso japonés el KC-767 lleva solo boom, lo que sería nuestro caso si se da de baja o reemplaza el F-5 por otro vector de origen estadounidense -un ahorro de costo el no tener que intervenir el ala para llevar pods de REVO/canasta-. No obstante lo anterior, están los 3 KC-130R FACh que hoy tienen capacidad para reabastecer por canasta en caso de necesitarlo) [IMG]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/4e/JASDF_KC-767_%28cropped%29.jpg[/IMG] Ahora, hay un detalle que me percaté al mirar los casos y es que nuestro 767-300ER es de pasajeros. Para mayor simplicidad habría que buscar un par de cargueros/freigther que ya traen 02 cargo doors para carga y pallets. [IMG]https://www.airdatanews.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/latam-boeing-767-freighter.jpg[/IMG] [IMG]https://i.insider.com/63dacde4e33c4000193a95f0?width=1000&format=jpeg&auto=webp[/IMG] El nuestro trae el portalón para los equipajes donde cabe carga de cierto tamaño, falta el portalón de los pallets en el nivel superior: [IMG]https://www.x.com/multimedia/images/1a666.jpg[/IMG] Cosa que si traen los KC-135 [IMG]https://www.x.com/images/showid/4753840[/IMG] Otra ventaja del 767 como carguero es su fuselaje ancho que permite mayor capacidad de carga: 58 toneladas vs 37,6 toneladas. [URL]https://www.boeing.com/farnborough2014/pdf/BCA/bck-767_5_13_2014.pdf[/URL] (767-300F Freighter) [URL]https://www.af.mil/About-Us/Fact-Sheets/Display/Article/1529736/kc-135-stratotanker/[/URL] (KC-135) Según lo que se relata en Air Force Montly en la página anterior, menciona que sin perjuicio de su llegada de refit desde EEUU el 982 tiene sus achaques por antiguedad. El "V" incluye el reemplazo de componentes electrónicos que después ya no serán soportados. El "V" es necesario logísticamente para proyectar la flota hacia 2040. Yo creo que es cosa de tiempo. Saludos [/QUOTE]
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